Here we are again with our next installment of the FIRE Community Guest Interview Series!

For anyone new here, this interview series will cover people within the FIRE community who are on their way to becoming financially independent, have already reached financial independence, or who have retired early. If you are reading this and you are financially independent, retired early, or close to reaching these major financial milestones, please reach out to the Modern Fimily! You can check out the previous FIRE Community Guest Interviews here.

Today, we have the pleasure of having Maria join us from Edmonton, AB. Hey neighbour! Maria is the brains behind the blog Handful Of Thoughts and you can also find her on Instagram @thoughtshandful. Maria dedicates her blog to three very important categories: money, mindset, and mom life.  Maria and her husband paid off their mortgage, which was close to $350,000, in less than 5 years!  How amazing is that!  As if that wasn’t enough, Maria and her husband took it up another notch and are real estate bosses with 9 rental units under their belt.  Oh yea and they both work full time jobs and have two little nuggets at home to take care of.  So we have back to back interviews where real estate has played a major role in chugging along to financial independence. 

I hope you appreciate these responses as much as I do and hope you can relate to these guest interviews in some sense to see that there is no cookie-cutter way to FI. If you have any follow up questions or would like to get in touch with Maria, please leave a comment on this post or reach out to her on her contact page. Without further ado, take it away Maria!


1. Can you give us a little background of who you are, what you do, and how you became interested in personal finance? How did you discover the idea of financial independence?

I’m Maria, the founder of Handful of Thoughts, a resource dedicated to helping moms take control of their time and money.  On top of that, I’m also a full-time high school teacher and mom to an energetic toddler and new baby. Yes, I’m exhausted most days.

I’ve always been a saver (or hoarder of money), and as I grew older, this developed into a passion for personal finance.  At an early age, I learned the connection between money and independence.  The more money I had, the more independent I could potentially be.

Eventually, I learned about the concept of financial independence from listening to the ChooseFI podcast.  My brother-in-law had suggested it to my husband, and I had started listening. I was all in from that point.  I now had a purpose for all my saving habits.

2. When in your journey did you realize financial independence was actually possible?  Was that the original goal at the beginning?

My goal has always been to have the freedom not to have to work consistently at a “day job”.  As a teenager, I dreamt of being a bit of a vagabond, traveling the world and working here and there to support my love of travel.

The problem with this dream is that there was no long-term thinking with it at the time. What would I do when I was much older? Would I still want to be a nomad when I was 65? 75? 85?  I had never considered it.

Eventually, I got married and we bought our first home. And then paid off the mortgage on that home.

After paying our mortgage off it felt like we were printing money every month.  We now needed to find another purpose for that money. So we decided on real estate as our investment vehicle of choice.

There was one point early on in our journey where we were talking to a financial advisor who was also a real estate mortgage broker and he told us that we didn’t have to invest in real estate to achieve our goals.  If we just invested our extra savings in conservative investments we would be just fine.

This was a light bulb moment for me. I always thought it would be possible for me not to have to work, but I thought it was only if my husband kept working. Here was someone telling us that we could eventually become financially independent.

This conversation along with the success stories I was listening to on ChooseFI really made it feel possible.

3. To help put things into context, if you are comfortable sharing some numbers, what is your savings rate, FIRE number, net worth, salary, how many hours a week you work, etc.?  How long have you been working towards financial independence, and where are you today? 

To be honest, I had never really tracked our saving rate until 2020. I had always done a little back-of-the-envelope calculation and was happy with the number so I never thought more of it.  But in 2020, one of my goals was to achieve a 50% saving rate, so I dove into all the ways to calculate it.

I’m proud to report that my household (my husband and I combine entirely all things finances) saving rate for 2020 was anywhere from 50-64% (depending on what calculation you use).

Our original FIRE number was $3 million. This is a very high number. But at the time we came up with it, we didn’t really know about FIRE. We just thought if we had a net worth of $3 million, we could liquidate all our assets and put that money into a fund that would generate 3-5% income and would be fine.

Due to anchoring bias, my husband is still stuck on that number even though it is much higher than we actually need for our daily expenses.

Because of our real estate investments, I don’t think we need an actual FIRE number.  We think of it more in how many properties do we need?  The more properties we have that are free-title (no mortgage), the more income they will generate for us.  

This income isn’t passive, but it also isn’t attached to a traditional 9-5 job.

It took us 8 years to accumulate our first $1 million in net worth. We are hoping the next $1 million will be faster than that.

4. Do you feel deprived?  Do you feel like you are sacrificing and missing out on life?  How would you say your mindset has shifted throughout your FI journey?

I do not feel deprived at all. 

But I’ve always been okay with delayed gratification.  As a child, I would always have Halloween candy left the following year because I would try and save it to make it last as long as I could.

Once we paid our mortgage off, we really sat down and focused on aligning our spending with our values.  There are certain things we spend no money on because they are not important to us (new cars, cable TV, new clothes). And there are other things that we spend more than the average family on because those things are important to us (hobbies, travel, food).

Throughout our FI journey, my mindset has shifted to be more comfortable with spending money.  I’ve come to realize that I wasn’t always a money saver. I was a money hoarder.  Spending money would give me anxiety, even if it were on things that brought me joy.

Through the years, I’ve slowly become more comfortable finding a balance between saving for later and enjoying today.

5. What do you spend your money on, and what don’t you spend your money on? What brings you happiness and joy? How much money do these things cost?

Travel is one of the big-spending categories for us. We travel hack and try to save as much as we can.  But with me being a teacher and having only summers and school holidays off, travel is often at the most expensive time of the year.  One thing we are really looking forward to when I’m done teaching is being able to travel in the shoulder seasons (spring & fall).

Our travel budget is usually around $10,000 – $15,000 a year.  We don’t always spend this much, but having a large buffer leads to great peace of mind.

I’m lucky that my hobbies don’t really cost much, and some generate income.  I love to read, write, and create things (knitting, sewing, blogging, etc.).

But my husband has more expensive hobbies.  He loves to ski and golf.  I’m constantly giving him a hard time because he picked the most expensive hobbies out there.

All in we probably spend close to $5000 a year on our hobbies (not including travel).

We also love food and eat gluten and dairy-free for the most part.  We don’t mind spending more buying our produce at the local farmer’s market either. Our food spending is more than “average” most months, but it’s something that we are okay with.

When it comes to not spending money, new things often don’t appeal to us.  We both drive older vehicles (that we albeit did buy brand new), and when we buy clothes, we wear them until can’t anymore. 

I love to shop second hand, so that is where most of the clothes and toys for our kids come from.

6. Do you use a budget?  Do you track your expenses? Do you track your net worth? If so, how often do you update these?

Early on in our relationship, my husband and I used to budget. I always thought of a budget as a strict hard, and fast rule. And would get very upset or frustrated if we went even $1 over in any category.  It became too much and really wasn’t helping.

Eventually, we shifted to just tracking our expenses.  This works for us because we have gone through our spending and really tried to align it with our values.  We have a high saving rate, so there is always wiggle room. 

I do track our net worth – I’m a numbers nerd too.  Although I track our investments more regularly, I only calculate our net worth twice a year.  I found when tracking it more frequently, there wasn’t as much change from month to month.

7. As a FI member living in Canada, are there any pros to living in Canada specifically that have helped you along your journey?  Conversely, any cons?  

One of the big pros for us recently has been living close to family.  We both still work, but thankfully, our parents are retired and help with childcare.  

We still pay for our childcare, but as my husband is a shift worker, we don’t need it every day.  With having family childcare, we only pay for the days we need it. And our kids love being around their grandparents so much.

Other than that, healthcare and post-secondary education are the 2 big things that immediately come to mind. We have never had to plan for tens of thousands of dollars for healthcare. 

And we were both able to finish post-secondary debt-free with minimal help from our families.  This was partly due to the lower cost of post-secondary and the scholarships that we were able to qualify for.

Being a teacher, is another bonus of living in Canada. We are paid well for what we do and have great benefits.  This is not always the case from what I’ve heard from my American teacher colleagues.

But a con to living in Canada is real estate.  Although we are real estate investors here, our portfolio would probably be much more significant with greater cash flow if we lived in the United States.

8. What is your investment strategy? Do you invest in mutual funds, index funds, dividend growth stocks, real estate, other businesses, etc.?  Has your investment strategy changed over the years? 

Our investment strategy can only be classified as all over the map.  

Although a significant portion of our investment portfolio is in real estate, and more specifically rental properties, we also do DIY investing in ETFs, have a portion of our portfolio actively managed with a wealth management company, and we invest in some private equity REITs (real estate investment trusts) and MICs (mortgage investment corporations).

Over the years, our investment strategy has evolved.  

When I first started investing, I was in mutual funds because that seemed like the thing to do at the time.  Eventually I moved those mutual funds into ETFs with much lower management fees.

As we got more invested in real estate, it became evident that we couldn’t have all our money there.  

The first year we invested in real estate, we were hit with a $13,000 tax bill.  After that, we started offsetting the taxes owed by investing money into ETFs in our RRSPs.

9. I know real estate has been a big driver in your passive income plans.  Can you please share with us your investing strategy when it comes to real estate? 

Like index fund or ETF investing, our real estate investing strategy is pretty dull.  We are long-term buy-and-hold investors.  This means that after doing our research, we buy a property and plan to own it for many years.

When it comes to investing in real estate, the key is to treat it like a business and keep emotion out of it when buying. But play to the emotional side of people wanting to rent it.

Things that you may want in your home (for example, a finished basement) may not really increase the rent of an investment property.  Only 2 of our 9 rental properties have finished basements.

Another thing you want to consider with rental properties is the tenant profile.  Before we started learning about real estate investing, we had no idea what this meant.  The tenant profile is who you want your ideal tenant to be.  Then you purchase properties to match that.

Our tenant profile is young families.  So when we were purchasing our properties we looked for newer homes near schools that had multiple bathrooms and ideally a garage (because Canadian winters are cold and snowy).

We always looked to purchase newer properties because they require less maintenance and are typically easier to rent out.  And because our tenant profile was young families we looked for single-family homes.

Owning suited properties (where someone could live in the basement and someone else could live upstairs) may lead to more cash flow.  But they can also lead to more headaches as the turnover in these properties tends to be higher. And you have to manage the relationship between the tenants.  This was an important consideration for us, too, because we self-manage all of our properties.

Currently, we are not in a buying phase but more of a hold phase.  

We own 9 rental properties (8 of them cashflow and the one that doesn’t is a unique case) and plan on keeping them and having the tenants pay down the mortgages.  Eventually, when the properties are mortgage-free, we can either live off the rents or liquidate our portfolio and invest everything in more passive investments.

One of the reasons we have this flexibility is because we never joint ventured with anyone when buying our properties.  Our portfolio could be much bigger if we wanted to partner with other people.  But that never appealed to us.  We only ever wanted to be accountable to ourselves.

Before we started investing in real estate, it was essential to me to pay off our mortgage. I never wanted to be in a situation in which we could lose our family home. 

In order to buy that many properties as fast as we did, we took out a HELOC (home equity line of credit) on our primary residence. And although this was leveraged investing, it was something that we were comfortable with.  In my mind, if everything went sideways, we could always liquidate the rental properties and still own our home.

We bought 4 properties our first year and then put all our savings back on the HELOC. When it had enough room, we would buy our next property.  We purchased our first property in 2015 and our “last” one in 2019.  

10 . Do you take advantage of tax-advantaged accounts offered to you?  If so, which ones and how so?  Do you have a game plan to be able to withdraw from these funds when the time comes, or is the plan to live solely off passive rental income?

Yes, our RRSPs play a big role in our investment strategy right now.  As mentioned above, we use them to help offset our annual tax bill.  But as we have a number of rental properties we are conscious of the fact that our incomes in “retirement” may be higher than they are now.  Because of this, waiting to withdraw from our RRSPs until the traditional retirement age doesn’t make sense.

Our plan is to work for a few more years (hopefully less) and then leave our day jobs.  Then we can slowly draw down our RRSPs to live off of while paying less tax.  Any excess funds we have at that time will be funneled into our TFSAs as they are relatively underfunded at the moment.

Rental income is definitely not passive, but the work involved will be much more manageable when we are not juggling it with our 2 full-time jobs.  And when we calculate our hourly rate, even though our rentals are not passive, they still provide a pretty good return on our time.

Eventually, if it becomes too much, we have talked about liquidating our rental portfolio and investing the money in ETFs. At that point, we should be able to comfortably live off of a 3% (or less) withdrawal.

But that’s years from now, so who really knows what exactly will happen.

11. Speaking of withdrawals, what is the withdrawal rate you plan to use when you withdraw from your portfolio?  Are you a fan of the 4% “rule” or something else?  Why?

Our withdrawal rate is somewhat unique and not set in stone. 

We have been investing in our RRSPs for tax purposes while we are still both working full-time.  When I transition away from full-time work, I will begin to withdraw from my RRSP.  The rate isn’t set yet but will be decided based on tax efficiency.  

When hubby leaves his full-time job, then we will also start to draw down his RRSP. 

We plan to liquidate our RRSPs and either spend that money on living expenses or roll it into our TFSAs.

Eventually, we will have no money left in our RRSPs, but our real estate portfolio should be in a much better cash flow position.  Depending on timelines, some of our properties may be mortgage-free, which is the ultimate goal.

Once our portfolio is mortgage-free, we have even more options.  We can continue to manage our properties, hire a property manager, or liquidate the portfolio and invest the money in something that is actually passive.

12. As a Canadian pursuing FI, what are your post-FIRE thoughts/plans regarding health coverage?  As a reference, what do you currently pay annually or monthly for health related costs (be it insurance, co-pays, deductibles, etc.)? What do you estimate your post-FIRE health costs to be per year?

Until recently we had never really thought of this question.  

My husband and I are both still currently working full time and each has great benefits through our employers.  And because we both have great family benefits we are never out of pocket.  What one plan doesn’t cover, the other one usually does. And if not, I also have access to a health spending account through my employer.

Now that we are slowly getting closer to achieving FI, we are starting to think more about what that looks like. 

Initially we thought that we would just pay out of pocket for any expenses.  But after listening to a great Explore FI Canada podcast episode, we are rethinking this.  We intend to look into our extended health care options and purchase some type of policy for our family. Although right now, we have no idea what that cost will be.

One benefit we do have is that our “FI number” is more than we need.  We like to build an extra buffer into everything (even if that means working 1 or 2 years longer). So we will have enough income to cover any healthcare plans we decide to enroll in.

13. As a parent, have you found that having children has greatly delayed your timeline to FIRE?  How much money have you spent on your daughter per year?  What were some of the bigger costs that were worth it, and what were some of the bigger costs that were not worth it?  Are you planning to open up an RESP for their post-secondary education?

If anything, having a little one (and now 2) has accelerated our path to FI.  Every day I’m at work, I would much rather be at home hanging out with my family.  My motivation has substantially increased since becoming a parent.

On average, we spend about $2500-$5000 on our little ones a year. That includes childcare (which is done by family), clothes, toys, and activities.  The range is so broad due to childcare. The more overtime my husband can get, the more we need childcare (but also, the higher our income and therefore savings will be for that month).  

Our spending doesn’t really include food because they eat what we eat. And it doesn’t include their RESPs because we consider them separate.

Although I should say that we are anticipating that amount to increase in the future as our little ones get more involved in athletics and other activities. But once we reach FI our childcare costs will be next to nothing so maybe things will even out.

We try to buy as much stuff as possible second-hand. And we were lucky to be one of the last ones in our families to have kids.  We benefited from many hand-me-downs and didn’t have to buy many of the large ticket baby items.

I’m also not into big fancy things so never felt the need to have all the baby gadgets and gizmos.  The best big-ticket items that we bought were car seats that we could use for years. 

Yes, we do have RESPs for our little ones.  

We have made it a priority as parents to contribute $2500 a year to our little ones’ RESPs (to get the maximum grant).  Any money they receive from birthdays or other occasions goes into their own investing accounts.  

Our daughter was born in September, and I made sure to open her RESP before the end of the year to get that extra grant money as early as possible.  Time in the market, right?

Because TFSAs don’t play a significant role in our current investment strategy, my TFSA is used in part as our little ones’ investment account.

14. If you could go back in time and change things, what would you have done differently?

Started earlier. 

Although I have always been a saver, I had no idea about investing.  I wish I had known about all the information available online sooner.  It wasn’t until we had already bought multiple investment properties that I had even heard of an index fund or ETF. 

I’m not saying learning more about the markets would have changed how we invest right now.  But I wish I would have invested my money sooner rather than just keeping it in a paltry savings account and Canada Savings Bonds.

15. Has discovering financial independence changed how you view your job and life overall? 

I’ve never wanted to work until the traditional retirement age. I just never knew this was called something until discovering the FI movement.

But discovering the term financial independence has made me more mindful overall.  Now I’m less likely to save for saving sake and am working towards enjoying the journey and my finances.

16. Have you come out of the FIRE closet yet? Meaning, do your friends, family, co-workers etc. know about your financial independence goals?  If so, how did you bring it up and what were their reactions?  If not, why not?  Why do you struggle with this conversation and why do you feel that money is such a taboo topic?  

Yes, I have always been very open about my plans to achieve financial independence, even before I knew FI was “a thing.”  I think because we haven’t pulled the trigger yet and left our day jobs that people think it is all still something in our heads. I don’t think they will truly believe it will happen until they see it.

Even though I’m open about my plans to achieve FI, very few still truly understand how we are setting ourselves up for it.  And a lot of people think that we are where we are financially because of my husband’s well paying job. 

This is super annoying.  

Thankfully my husband will be the first person to tell you that we are where we are because of not only our incomes but how we chose to manage our money, something I play a prominent role in.

I personally love talking about money and personal finance.  And sometimes I get a little too passionate about it, and my husband has to tell me to scale back a little.  Or only talk to people about their money if they invite the conversation.

17. What pieces of advice would you suggest to someone who is just starting out or someone who is working toward reaching financial independence? 

Find someone’s story that resonates with you, learn from them, and then make your own choices.  There are so many great content creators now with diverse voices that it’s easier now than ever to find someone that resonates with you.

But I don’t think you should blindly follow someone else’s path.  Learn from others and then make your own choice and do things “your way.”

18. What does the word ‘success’ mean to you?

Autonomy. The freedom to make my own choices (good or bad).  This includes how to earn, spend, donate, and invest my money.  And how to spend my time.

19. Are there any books, blogs, or podcasts that you would recommend for our readers to check out?

So many.  

The amount of voices in the personal finance space has exponentially increased lately.  It’s becoming much easier to find someone whose voice you resonate with.

Canadian Podcasts – ExploreFI Canada 

Canadian Real Estate Book – Real Estate Investing in Canada by Don R. Campbell (fun fact – Don donates all the proceeds from his book sales to Habitat for Humanity).

20. How can people get in contact with you? 

You can follow my story on my blog Handful of Thoughts. And I am also on Twitter and Instagram with the handle @thoughtshandful.


Love this interview and Maria’s energy! Here are some of our key take-aways from this interview:

  • It’s super interesting to hear Maria refer to her past self as a money hoarder.  When I try to think back (I have a terrible memory!) I think I was too growing up.
  • I find it fascinating that anchoring bias is keeping Maria’s husband tied to their initially made up $3 million goal.  Money is soooo emotional and this is a prime example of that.
  • I too was that weirdo kid at Halloween trying to slowly chip away at my candy stash throughout the year.  Delayed gratification at it’s finest!
  • So excited for their future shoulder season travel plans.  That is our favorite time to travel as there are typically fewer crowds, more availability, and cheaper prices.
  • Love reading about what people do and don’t spend their money on.  It’s all about your values!
  • Maria outlines exactly why I’m not a fan of budgeting.  It’s too easy to get down on yourself about it.  Track track track and you’re good to go.
  • Loveeee all the details Maria provided regarding their real estate strategy, thanks for all of that!
  • Also love her response to kids.  They are the motivation that makes you want to reach FI faster!

Thank you again Maria for being a part of our FIRE Community Guest Interview Series.  In next month’s interview, we have Adam who is a Canadian expat that is greatly accelerating his family’s path to FI by living abroad. 

Did you enjoy this interview? Any additional questions for Maria? Thanks for tuning in and check back next month for the next interview.

We love highlighting other members of the FI community. Please contact us if you’d like to be a part of the FIRE Community Guest Interview series and we’ll see if we’re a good fit!

And in case you wanted to read the previous interviews that make up our FIRE Community Guest Interview Series, here you go!

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8 thoughts on “FIRE Community Guest Interview #19 – Money Savvy Teacher With 9 Properties”

    1. Thank YOU Maria for opening up and sharing so much of your story to our readers! I’m sure there are many people who can relate to your path to FI as well as others who are inspired by it.

  1. Maria—I read your interview as soon as it came out, and I’m sorry I’m so late to comment! I always love relearning your story and hearing about how you invest in real estate.

    I don’t know how to explain it, but you’re unlike other real estate investors out there. I like the way you and your husband do it. Yes, you treat it like a proper business, but it’s clear that you’re very compassionate and human-focused about it. I wish all RE investors were like you!

    Anyway, thanks for sharing your story here. It’s always nice to hear it again, in a slightly different way!

    1. I agree Chrissy – it’s very evident that Maria and her husband take a holistic view on their real estate portfolio and I also love how Maria, like all of us, have had to slowly figure out what works best through trial and error. Taking the leap is the hardest part for most people. It’s clearly paying off now for Maria and her hubby seeing how they’ve been able to grow their RE portfolio!

  2. Late to comment here but I really enjoyed this interview. Maria, with you being a teacher and a real estate investor (as well as in Alberta), your story has really resonated with me. I learnt a lot from this post but am now off to binge read your blog! Thanks Court and Maria!

    1. Nothing wrong with late comments Cass! Yes, wow, soooo many similarities! I know who will be chatting at the next summertime ChooseFI Alberta Camping weekend 😉

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